One of the most hotly anticipated shows at Camden Fringe this year is The Making of Frederick the Great, which will be playing at The Cockpit every Sunday in August.
The play is described as “a revolutionary reimagining of the life of Frederick the Great… that boldly challenges the traditional masochistic narrative associated with this historic icon. Rather than focusing solely on his military exploits, this production strives to portray Frederick the Great in a much broader light, illuminating aspects of his identity that were previously obscured in the history books. The play explores Frederick’s queer identity, intertwining a largely untold aspect of his personal life with the public persona that earned him his moniker.”
Frederick is co-produced and co-directed by rising star Charlotte Kindred, a Guildford School of Acting graduate who will also be starring in the ambitious play.
Charlotte and I go way back. She is, without a doubt, one of the most creative and talented people I know – and I work across theatre, television, and print media so I know a lot of creative and talented people!
It is for this reason that, ahead of her professional debut, I wanted to spotlight Charlotte in The Mancunion – a paper whose most recent interviewees include Sacha Lord, Katie McGlynn, and Noel Gallagher.
Before beginning the interview, Charlotte and I caught up a little. We spoke about my securing media accreditation for Eurovision, which I was attending in a few days time, and Charlotte’s experience at The Olivier Awards (and the exclusive after-party!), both of which were hosted by theatre-turned-television icon Hannah Waddingham. We always knew we’d be killing it!
Finally, Charlotte and I began talking about the reason for our reunion: her new play, The Making of Frederick the Great.
Charlotte admitted that she has been working on the project for quite some time, albeit in secret. The play was written by Eliza Larkey, who is producing, casting and directing the play alongside Charlotte. Charlotte and Eliza both work for theatre marketing companies, and they met on a train (sounds like the beginning of a play itself, doesn’t it?) when they were travelling to Plymouth to do some work on Bugsy Malone.
The girls got talking about their interests outside of work. Charlotte told Eliza about her short film about the Pendle Witches (we’re from Pendle), Alice – which prompted Eliza to tell her that she loves history and has written a play about Frederick the Great.
The girls exchanged work and discussed their ambitions further: Eliza wants to be a writer, Charlotte wants to be an actor and dabble in directing, and both know a lot about producing because of their jobs. Charlotte loved Eliza’s script and decided to collaborate with her in hopes of bringing the play to life – and here we are!
I knew very little about Frederick the Great so Charlotte offered me a little history lesson: Frederick the Great was an 18th century Prussian monarch. He was a formidable ruler with unlikely beginnings. Whilst his father was still King, Frederick was having sexual and romantic relations with men – something which was not properly recorded in history because, well, homophobia…
The play follows Frederick’s metamorphosis from an artistic, book-loving, queer man to, perhaps, one of the most aggressive Kings in European history. The play explores what he had to lose to become King, thus, it’s not a celebration of his “greatness”, but, rather, an interrogation of what makes one “great”. The play, then, aims to reclaim and shine a light on a part of history which has long been ignored.
I had wondered if there were some queer themes in the play because Charlotte and Eliza had explicitly called for queer actors to audition – and the play’s poster featured a hand with painted nails.
As cisgender women, Charlotte and Eliza were keen for queer creatives to come on board. However, the play is not defined by queerness, per se, but, rather, it is about a man that happens to be queer – and the implications of this.
Charlotte told me that the play is a combination of Eliza’s sheer knowledge (she has been researching Frederick and writing this play for around three years) and Charlotte’s approach to direction. There are books and podcasts about Frederick the Great but there is very little visual media – which is how most ordinary people come to learn about historical figures and little-told stories.
Indeed, whilst there are many historical musicals out there – from Six to Hamilton, and now Sylvia – they are generally about historical figures who most people are aware of. But most people know very little about Frederick the Great – if they even know him at all.
Charlotte admits that she and Eliza are excited about telling the story of a lesser-known historical figure but told me, “Frederick the Great is obviously less well-known, in our world, in our cultural knowledge, but in [mainland] Europe, he’s very well-known.”
Of course, we look at history with a British lens, and we have such a colourful Royal history (and present!) that we tend to pay little attention to other monarchies.
The girls are especially excited to tell the real story.
Unlike the aforementioned musicals, Frederick is a straightforward play but Charlotte does not want audiences to think that the tone is serious and dark. It’s actually quite light-hearted and funny, at least to begin with: at the centre of this story about a monarch is a queer love story – but the play will not shy away from the difficulty and tragedy of queer love in a time where it was forbidden.
Frederick’s lover, Hermann von Katte, was the best soldier in Prussia, which, again, challenges stereotypes of gay men. Katte was in the King’s (Frederick’s father) army; the King adored him – until he fell in love with his son.
I was curious as to how the play will show Frederick and Katte’s falling in love. There are many historical figures who were said to be queer, including several British monarchs, but I do wonder how two queer people initiated a romantic and/or sexual partnership, what with homosexuality being illegal. There were no dating apps back then!
Charlotte told me that we meet Frederick and Katte before they are together but they fall in love quickly.
“It’s like your first experience of love, that excitement, when you really fancy someone,” Charlotte said. “They really fancy each other; there’s so much chemistry. It’s almost Bridgerton-esque. That’s the way in.”
Charlotte said that the story of Frederick the Great is surprising – not just because of the homosexuality but also the fallout of that – which will make it very exciting to watch.
“That’s what I was really drawn to when I first read the script: you’re always being surprised; it doesn’t sit still.”
Indeed, the second act introduces Maria Theresa, a ruler of the Habsburg dominions in the 18th century and the only woman to hold the position suo jure (in her own right). She was the sovereign of Austria, Hungary, Croatia, Bohemia, Transylvania, Mantua, Milan, Galicia and Lodomeria, the Austrian Netherlands, and Parma – and by marriage, she was Duchess of Lorraine, Grand Duchess of Tuscany, and Holy Roman Empress. Why, then, is she not a fixture of the history books?
“She’s a really formidable character. In the second half, when [Frederick] is now Frederick the Great, we meet Maria Theresa, and it’s about their face-off – who’s gonna conquer the most land? So, it’s a homosexual man and a woman at the head of these really powerful countries, going head to head, and we don’t really know about it. We’re boldly redefining the narrative of what it means to be ‘great’.”
Charlotte thinks that the play has mass appeal and could have a commercial life: “I think it will appeal to people who are interested in history, people who are interested in new writing, and people who like Shakespeare, but also people who like watching trending historical TV like Bridgerton. It’s got an interesting demographic,” she explained.
I asked Charlotte about her roles in the production. As new producers of a fringe play, Eliza and Charlotte are having to do everything, but whilst she admits “it’s a lot,” I know Charlotte, and I know how much she loves to be in control of her art – and I know that, with her at the helm, this play is sure to be a critical success.
“A producer has got to wear so many hats and juggle everything. It stops with you so if you don’t do anything then nothing’s going to happen,” she said frankly.
Charlotte has had some experience as a director, directing her own short film about the Pendle Witches, Alice. She also co-directed the short film I had to create as a trainee on the Channel 4 Production Training Scheme (Perfection, which is about social media performativity), alongside Anja Samy, the head of Manchester Media Group, of which The Mancunion is a part of; the film was made in collaboration with Fuse TV.
But this brand-new play is the biggest moment of Charlotte’s career so far.
The girls have already done some directing on the play; they did a few developmental sessions at Guildford School of Acting, where Charlotte was a student.
“[Eliza and I] are tag-team directing but taking on quite different roles. My role is managing the space and the actors in the space and producing the scenes, whereas Eliza will do research with the cast and help with the historiography of it,” she explained.
“I’m going to encourage the actors to bring their own ideas to the space and have a really collaborative environment,” Charlotte said. “But we’ve got quite a strong vision already so I’m saying ‘we’re really collaborative’ but we’ve got a vision going in,” she humorously acknowledged.
“Open to other thoughts,” I said.
“A hundred percent. You know what I’m like, Jamaal,” she laughed (Jamaal is my real name, in case you’re wondering).
Charlotte told me that her being an actor first is quite useful because she thinks about what would work for her if she was an actor in that position – and she is, of course, starring in this play.
However, I have often wondered if it is tough to take on a dual role of both actor and director – how do you direct something that you are starring in? I used The Handmaid’s Tale‘s Elisabeth Moss as an example, which prompted a brief discussion about that terrifically topical but terrifyingly timely television series, which Charlotte admits is her favourite show right now.
“My aim in life is to be in my own work, direct my own work; I kind of wanna do everything, I wanna wear all the hats – so, I think, why not start now? I might as well do what Elisabeth Moss is doing and eventually get to her position,” Charlotte explained.
However, she admitted that it will have its challenges: “It’s gonna be hard to be objective about my own performance,” she laughed. “But I’ve got Eliza so I’m not doing it on my own.”
“I’m going to take on the role of Maria Theresa” – I knew she would be; Charlotte excels at playing boss bitches – “and it’s a strategic role to take on because she’s only in the second act. In the first act, I’ll concentrate on the other actors, and when we get to the second act, Eliza will take on more of that directing role as well.”
I asked Charlotte what drew her to this role.
“I’m just drawn to these characters who have got real authority. I think I’m just drawn to strong women generally. If I get to choose what character I’m playing, I’m going to cast myself in the roles that I want to [play]. I’m really excited for the challenge of playing such an influential figure but also balancing that with vulnerability because she has quite a lot of vulnerable moments where she questions herself because everyone else is questioning her. She struggles to get people onside because she’s a woman, as you can imagine in that time period,” she explained.
“I just played the Prime Minister at GSA [in] my final show,” she told me. The play was 13 by Mike Bartlett, directed by Anna Marsland, who, like us, hails from Burnley but is now a very successful director in London – in fact, Resident Director at the National Theatre!
“I played the Prime Minister; I might as well play a Royal!” Charlotte laughed.
“You’ll conquer it, I’m sure,” I told her – which I now realise is quite the pun.
The play, whilst led by a man and focused on his love affair with another man, does feature several female characters, as well as Maria Theresa – such as Frederick’s mother, Queen Sophia, and sister, Wilhemine – and the play explores their relationships with Frederick and Katte over time.
“The sister, for example, is really supportive of Fred’s relationship with Katte and is really excited about it,” she explained.
Whilst the play has some great female characters, there are some smaller male characters, such as political advisors and informers: “We can cast women in those parts because why not?”
Charlotte then told me that the play alternates between two time lines rather than take a linear approach. In one timeline, Frederick the Great is merely “Fred”. Charlotte admits that the non-linear timeline will be their biggest challenge, as directors, but Eliza overlaps scenes very cleverly, for example, Fred’s coronation overlaps with his father’s death. At another point, Frederick the Great and Maria Theresa give speeches to their armies in the same scene – though not during the same conflict but rather in different times.
“It’s all interlinked. I think the idea of it is that the title of ‘The Great’ is circular, and it stays in that family and it communicates succession without explicitly talking about it; it’s quite a clever device,” she explained, before adding, “It’s quite relevant as well, with the Coronation coming up.”
This prompted me to ask Charlotte why this historical story is relevant today – why should people be interested in it?
“The play is crucially relevant today,” Charlotte said passionately. “We are uncovering a story that has not yet been told, a story that was hidden by the history books. We hope by shining a light on Frederick the Great’s queer identity, we can encourage people to think twice about the narratives we are told and be open-minded about history.
“I think the more stories we can get out there that had identities that weren’t accepted will encourage people to be more open-mined about people’s sexuality today and female relationships and things like that – so I think it has quite an important political message as well.”
She also spoke about the “Royal” aspect: “Particularly in British culture, we’re obsessed with the Royal family… Bridgerton, The Crown – it’s kind of a timeless thing but we’re bringing new Royals into the equation!”
“I think the story of Prince Harry and Meghan is quite relatable to the story of Katte and Fred,” she added. “Obviously, that’s a heterosexual relationship [whilst] this is a homosexual relationship but they’re still very much a love couple, and I think what’s interesting about the two comparisons is [the Princes are] debating whether to prioritise love over their titles, and Frederick chooses quite a different destiny to Harry – and if he had the option to choose love, I’m sure Frederick the Great would have done. I think [that comparison] makes it relevant.”
Writer, co-director and co-producer Eliza Larkey subsequently added: “We are excited to bring a new perspective on Frederick the Great’s life to our stage. We believe it’s crucial to revisit historical narratives and shed light on the lesser-known aspects of their lives, especially when they challenge our preconceived notions and make us reflect on our own times.”
The Making of Frederick the Great runs at The Cockpit, as part of Camden Fringe, every Sunday in August. There will be a 6pm performance on August 6 and 4pm performances on August 13, 20 and 27.
